Ep 158 | Back to school blues? Feelings, friends & communication

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Developing a level of self-awareness, I think, is really good so that they aren't like dismissing what they feel because they want to keep this friendship.

SPEAKER_01 0:09

Yes. Oh my gosh, that's so tricky, but so important because how many adults have you met who can't hear their own voice? Welcome to the Voices United in Education podcast. Each week we showcase the teachers, administrators, and community members who go the extra mile to contribute to the success of every student in Escambia County. You'll meet the real people behind the titles and learn about the amazing resources to support every student's success. New crayons, new backpacks, fresh kicks. There's a lot of reasons for kids to get excited about back to school. But for many, it brings on a dread bigger than just the end of summer break bummers. It can be the most stressful time of year for both kids and parents, leaving everyone wondering: is there a better way to do this? My next guest is a licensed mental health counselor and owner of Greenhouse Counseling in Pensacola, specializing in children and families. Today she's going to share insights in the areas of feelings, friends, and communication to make back-to-school transitions smoother. Champion for thriving, advocate for adapting, mental health mentor, and Woodham High School graduate Phaedra Smith. Thanks for being here. I like that.

SPEAKER_00 1:30

Yeah? You make me sound really good.

SPEAKER_01 1:32

Well, good. You are really good. And I appreciate you making time for this because you've got a busy life of your own. But back to school time, it's just so hectic, which is a part of the problem. The good news is that mental health has definitely entered the mainstream conversation, which is good for both adults and kids. I think the less good news is that some are using that conversation to make their mental health struggles their entire personality. So my first question is how do you help your child feel their feelings without allowing them to over-identify with the label of those feelings?

SPEAKER_00 2:11

Yeah, I love that question. What I do both in therapy and with my own children is I just rephrase it. So I had a client that was saying, my depression, right? And I just said depression. And I just repeated it. And I think taking it from being something that you own as a part of your like identity and putting it outside of yourself is a really good way to do that. So really just modeling or reframing what your children are saying it, but in a different way so that they are hearing it differently. So it's not my anxiety or my depression or even my ADHD, right? We don't define ourselves by these things. We recognize that like I might have a struggle and I might think differently or feel really big feelings, right? But it's not who I am as a person. So I think the biggest thing is to reframe it from being yours to just something outside of you.

SPEAKER_01 3:13

That's so good because on the one hand, we kind of know words matter, but on the other hand, I think when it becomes inconvenient, then we're like, those words aren't that important. And so it's almost like the reverse of keeping the person first when you talk about disability, right? Because that's something that I'm kind of tuned into. So it's not, you know, the autistic kid, it's the kid with autism. So the person is first. Correct. And it's almost like we're a little bit mean to ourselves. Yeah. I mean, it's also become kind of popular to say my anxiety, my ADHD. Oh, I can't do that because of my agoraphobia. Yeah, I'm afraid to leave the house or whatever. The labels have become abundant.

SPEAKER_00 3:58

Right. Right. I do think we have become more dependent on that. And I think in a way, for some people, it brings empathy or makes them feel more comfortable because maybe, you know, they've picked up that role. And I think for a lot of us as parents, we have to make sure we're watching how we are identifying ourselves as well. Because I have found that it's not like typically always what you say, but it's what you model. So what am I doing every day? Because that's what my child is picking up on.

SPEAKER_01 4:32

That's so true. Right. Because if it exists in popular culture, the chances that we as adults are saying it without giving it a lot of thought, like, oh my anxiety, even as a joke, then the kids they pick that up. That's an interesting approach. I like how you do that at Greenhouse actually, because when we had your partner on, she was talking about how the counseling approach is with the parent and the child. It's not a drop the child off and we'll fix them and bring them back to you in a few weeks. And that's really the whole family approach, which seems like a good model. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 5:10

Because you can only teach them so much, but biggest influences are the people that they live with, you know. So if there's chaos in the home or how you frame things in the home, like that's what's gonna really stick with them way more than what they're learning in 50 minutes. Oh, that's so true.

SPEAKER_01 5:26

Yeah. Friends are another big influence though. And making friends, it's such a tricky thing for all people involved, right? Because you want your kids to have friends, but you want them to have the right friends. And how do you know that they're the right friends? Making friends as a kid was so simple as a little kid, right? Oh my gosh, you're a kid, I'm a kid. That was best friends. Oh, I know, and that's so precious. It's like when kid can we please just go back there. It was enough. And it gets trickier as kids get older. What friendship pitfalls are parents trying to avoid nowadays?

SPEAKER_00 6:01

Man, that's a loaded question. I'll speak from a parent perspective as well as therapists. What I've seen in my office is just parents that, regardless of what that belief system is, they really want their kids to be around people that treat them nicely. That's the simplest way to put it, right? But that also have positive influences because uh the way I parent might not be the way your friends parent parents, right? And so, really, what I have found to be the most effective tool is educating your children early, like not just waiting until they go to school to help them figure out, you know, what's the best type of friend to be around or how to navigate, you know, these pitfalls that might happen in a friendship and what's healthy and what's not healthy. So, really as a parent, I just started talking to my children early, early on, just like, hey, this is what we value, this is what we believe, this is how, you know, we want you to be as a human, and this is what you deserve to also have in a friendship as well. So that when something happens is not a surprise. And you can't prepare for everything. But I think also not being that parent that freaks out when the children come and say, Hey, this happened. Like my daughter, I'm not afraid to say this, I randomly check her group chats because she's in elementary school. I think that's wise. And and so there was one time there was all kinds of cursing and stuff happening, and I was like, I know kids curse, but also this is weird. Like, and so yeah, because it was just calling names and things that like was not appropriate. And so my daughter wasn't a part of it, thankfully, but I had to navigate with her. Do you want your friend to be talking to you this way? Would you talk to your friend this way? How does that make you feel when you hear these words? And so, really developing a level of self-awareness, I think is really good so that they aren't like dismissing what they feel because they want to keep this friendship.

SPEAKER_01 8:06

Yes. Oh my gosh, that's so tricky, but so important because how many adults have you met who can't hear their own voice? Correct. And they end up in abusive relationships, they don't know how to choose their career path. Everything depends on hearing your own voice. So, what does that look like for parents who are sending their kids, you know, back to school in the fall and you're talking about friendships? Maybe they don't have that benefit of thinking these thoughts early like you have. Yeah. They're just trying to step into that intentionality. How do you recommend that they start those conversations where none have previously existed?

SPEAKER_00 8:45

That's good. So I get to take my kids to school and pick them up most days. And so, but regardless of that, like when you're in the car, turn off the electronics and leave space for silence and conversations with your child. I think that's probably one of the biggest things that helped us out is like every now and then we'll just have a time where we're like, we're just gonna all not be in all like our electronics in the car so we can have intentional conversations or asking your child, how was your day? And when they inevitably say, fine, right? Then I say, Well, what was fine about it? Or good, well, what was good about it? Or can you give me a high and a low?

SPEAKER_01 9:29

Right.

SPEAKER_00 9:30

And it prompts them to think about both the good and maybe not so good stuff. And then also being patient, you know, like allowing them to come into a place of feeling safe with having those uncomfortable conversations. I know for me, my kids know that I'm a mama bear, and so they're really picky with what they tell me. I don't know if that's a good or bad thing. But one of the things I have been trying to really teach them is that like what my role is, and that is to keep you safe. And so it doesn't always look like I'm gonna go run up to the school and cause craziness, right? I want to internally, but it does look like me teaching you how to advocate for yourself, right? And so, whether that be friendships or with teachers or whatever. So I think having those intentional conversations in the car, maybe something easy to do. Just creating the space, creating the space and then reminding them what your role is and what might be causing them anxiety, you know, about telling you the hard things. And then creating those, like, hey, what's what were the highs and the lows today? Just being really detailed, because most kids stay above the surface with their parents for whatever reason. And so I just think having those good questions is really helpful too. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 10:45

Yeah. Because I think that goes back to hearing your own voice, right? Because and and also like that that reconciliation of the internal and the external. Oh, I'm coming home and I'm in a sour mood. And they don't know. They don't know why they're in a sour mood. This sounds so silly to ask, but like, is there a resource for these sorts of conversational prompts? You know, they there's journal prompts, there's icebreaker prompts on the internet. Is there something for parents where they can get some sample questions to try out? Because I imagine there's an element of trial and error experimentation because every kid is so different, right? Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 11:30

I have not been able to find specific things. I think there it's all over the internet. You could Google some stuff, but also like there are games you can buy on Amazon that are like questions that you can play with your kids. And we use them in therapy as well to help with like family therapy, but also as like sort of icebreaker questions. There's a game, I don't know if this is an actual thing, but yeah, you can amp, you can look it on Amazon. There it's called Thumb Ball. Okay. And so it's just a ball, like a small ball that has little questions on it, and you just throw it back and forth, and wherever your thumb lands is the question you ask. So, I mean, you don't want to do this while you're driving, but it can be something that you can do at home. But it it comes back to being, I think, intentional and then normalizing having these conversations. So for a lot of us, this isn't something we typically grew up with, but I think normalizing these conversations, also you being open about your feelings is helpful. This goes back to modeling, you letting them know that you get sad, that you get upset, because they need to also be able to see how to make repairs and you know, cope effectively so that they know like it's okay for me to be sad and acknowledge that, because I don't have to stay here. There are ways that I can feel better as well.

SPEAKER_01 12:50

I love that. So when it comes to the friendship part, knowing yourself, you know, connecting your external and your internal, how does that overlap with identity? Because when you make new friends as a kid, there's especially I think young, young women, we're so adaptable that we can often get sucked into group behaviors, right? And group identities and and being a young person is kind of just about that in general, right? How can a parent help a child be anchored in what whoever they're becoming as a grown-up, right as a as a little grown-up in the making, while they're also, you know, trying to make friends.

SPEAKER_00 13:40

So I'll tell you this little short, funny story. I don't know if it's funny, but I remember going on a family trip with one of my good friends and her family, and we parent differently. You know, it doesn't matter, but my kids I think that they forgot that I was their mom and that I parent differently. And so at one point I brought them back in the room and I was like, I just said, I just told them what their name was. I said, you are Parker, Nicole Smith. And I just had to reground her, like, and I was like, you know, how do what are our family like values and rules? Right. Not that anybody else's is wrong, but I want you to remember who you are, right? So I think reminding them, but you can't remind someone of something if you haven't talked about it. And so again, it comes back to having these conversations. You know, it doesn't matter the age. Like you can establish this while they're in high school. Like you can just start letting this be a new norm for you guys. So I think, I think one of the pitfalls for most parents is consistency because it is new and it is different. And so remembering to do this new thing and normalizing it can be hard at first. But I think also seeing the value in it is helpful because when they go off to college, for example, they're gonna need to remember who they are because those days are are are just as difficult. You're still figuring yourself out at like even when you're 18, 19, you know, early 20s. So I think again, it comes back to having those conversations as well as really educating yourself as a parent on like emotions, like feelings and using those words more often. Feelings words? Feeling words, yeah. Happy, sad, you know, angry, exhausted, tired. Because then you can feed your child the words to like to help them if they can't figure out what is going on. I think that was one of the things you mentioned was when your child comes home and they don't know what's wrong with them, right? And so I think you being able to be better about learning emotions and feelings, and so you can help your child figure out what is going on so then they can meet the need. I can't meet a need if I don't know what the problem is.

SPEAKER_01 15:56

Do you ever use the chart of feelings, you know, the color one where it has the primary and secondary emotion? Is that helpful for like the average person or is that just for mental health nerds?

SPEAKER_00 16:09

It's helpful for the average person. This is why I say it, because now you have a visual example of what to have. And so I would say my clients love it and hate it because it prompts them to stop and reflect. And this is very difficult for a lot of us to say, man, I don't know what the feeling is. And then so a lot of times what what we hear is, and I've done this before, is man, I just feel a type of way. And you're like, I know what you mean because I know what it is to feel a type of way, but also that's not gonna be helpful. Right. You know, right. So I just give them this, you know, we call it the feeling circle, which you can buy on Amazon. And it's it's been is it I think it's been effective for also my family as well.

SPEAKER_01 16:56

What about technology? You mentioned a group chat with your daughter. I recently learned that a lot of kids have tracking on their phones. I think it's initiated by the parent as a safety tool, but I learned that the kids track each other. And to me, that seems like really a setup for some abusive behavior on part of like their little romantic partners. Or I've noticed that it creates a really heavy duty helping a FOMO. What? Susie's at the movie theater. Why didn't she invite me? Oh my gosh, look, these other three friends of mine are also, they went, they went without me, you know, or maybe that child got in trouble, like she's grounded. And so what does she do? She doesn't have any apps, but she gets on her phone. She didn't need apps. She has this little whatever iPhone family, whatever it's called. And she's like, that's where her FOMO comes from. It's, you know, this is an example of a student who doesn't even have TikTok or Pinterest or nothing.

SPEAKER_00 18:02

I think that's a big question. I think that that has to be something that you as a parent have to decide. So for me, I didn't even know my daughter was doing it. And I was like, she was like, oh, such and such is already home. And me and my husband were like, How do you know? And she was like, Oh, I see it right here. And I was like, and my husband was like, that's weird. Like, why are you doing that? And so it was something that now we had to talk about, how we felt about it. And honestly, I had not even thought about the FOMO part until like just now, and how that can also cause, you know, mental health issues as well. Cause now you're worried about what other people are doing instead of being present, also, right? And so, yeah, I do think that less is better. Like they have so much time to do all the things and be exposed to all the things. But I really do that that think that that comes down to just the individual parent and what they're comfortable with and also what they see. Cause what might be okay now, if you start seeing issues later, being okay with saying, hey, we're gonna pivot and change and this is no longer good for you.

SPEAKER_01 19:16

That's I think that's probably very comforting for you to give permission to parents listening that they don't have to stick with something if it's not working. Correct. That's pretty major. And I I'm gonna ask you this. I think I know what you're gonna say, but because parents have limited time, limited energy, when something like this comes up and there's, you know, an app they didn't know about or an aspect to an app they didn't know about, like you said, the FOMO, should parents A, invest their whatever time and energy they have in learning about all the things, like, you know, the calculator app that hides the that's actually a messaging app, or B, focus on those intentional communication moments with their kid.

SPEAKER_00 19:57

Yeah, it's the latter. Yeah. Because you just can't know about everything. And you're not a bad parent because you don't know all the things. There's just gonna be certain things that your children are going to decide to do. And I think that building that self-awareness, you know, when I worked for the child advocacy center, the Gough Coast Kids House, one of the first things we did with kiddos is we taught them safety skills because the parents were just so afraid of something else happening. Right. And so we reinforced and also taught the parents safety things. And that is what started to alleviate the anxiety because now I know my child knows what to do. And that goes back to if I can build self-awareness for me internally and also support my child and being aware of, hey, I'm doing this thing, and it did feel okay, but now it doesn't. And it's okay for me to change my mind and also share with this person, this no longer feels good for me and I can pivot. So you won't know everything. I don't think it's effective for you to try to know everything, but I'm sure there's, you know, built-in safety protocols. I know for the iPhone, like I can literally lock everything down if I want to. So if you're gonna spend time on something, maybe learn about the phone situation and how you can build some safety in there. But also knowing I can't protect my child from everything, but I can teach them who they are, help them learn their values and what's important to them, and identify feelings and give them permission to know that they can change their minds.

SPEAKER_01 21:36

How as a parent do you not freak out when your kiddo has that wonderful moment of open honesty about something that's happened or something they're feeling and it doesn't align with what you taught them?

SPEAKER_00 21:49

I think that what you can do is hide your inner thoughts and feelings because it's not about you. And honestly. Just remember that they're a person first before they're even your child. And so, what are the most important things that I want my child or this human being to know about themselves? I think that is probably what what helps me is at the end of the day, they're probably already gonna need therapy because of me, because I just think we can't shield them from everything. You know, they get to see the the good, the bad, and the ugly with us because they live with us. But man, I really don't want to traumatize them in a way that they don't feel safe.

SPEAKER_01 22:40

Right. That cuts off further communication.

SPEAKER_00 22:42

Correct. Yeah. Correct. And we all go through life changes also. Like, you know, what I might have believed when I was in eighth grade, like, I thought I was gonna be in a musical group. You know, so but just trusting the process. My parents just let me live the thing out. You know, they took me to these places and let me sing. Hope nobody has recordings of that, but but they just let me be who I was. And so I think that that is effective. But again, if you can help them sort through, hey, well, you know, what what do you believe? And so I I do ask a lot of questions. Like, so they might ask me, but then I turn it around. Well, that's what mommy thinks, but what do you think about it? And I think it it's promoting them really using their own brains and figuring out like problem solving and getting used to also not having you around all the time.

SPEAKER_01 23:38

So Which must be hard as a parent, right? Because you see them as like the little, little guy, little girl, and and then they grow up and that's that's a hard transition too. It sounds like the theme of what you're saying is there's a a lot of intentionality behind every answer. This is not like a how-to flow chart or it can't be because life isn't like that, and you don't know what's gonna happen tomorrow. So do you feel like as far as maintaining that groundedness, which is also safety, do affirmations work?

SPEAKER_00 24:14

Honestly, I think they do because whether we know it or not, we are even we we can be also giving ourselves like negative affirmations. Very true. I remember working out with my personal trainer some years ago. And I one day just realized like I was so negative, you know, about like one thing in particular, like a box jump. I was like, I can't do this. And I kept saying it. And when I started to pivot the way I thought and the things I was telling myself, I was able to have the confidence to do it. And so it seems so like small, but yeah, I do think what you say to yourself, whether negative or positive, really does affect your mental but also physical. So yeah, I do think positive affirmations are good. And I think you can teach your child that you can build that into, you know, what we believe as a family, right? We believe this. And so for me, with my kids, every morning we say a prayer and we read a scripture together. And so that for me is important because they get to decide how they're gonna live the rest of their lives out. But this is right now what we believe. And so I just want that fact to be with them. And so these are facts you're trying to teach your children. What facts are you are you is your family like living by? And so, yeah, if I can teach my child to say, you know, I can do this, right? Or I'm enough. I make friends easily. I like that.

SPEAKER_01 25:40

I stole it from somebody else, can't take credit.

SPEAKER_00 25:42

Or having one friend is okay.

SPEAKER_01 25:45

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 25:46

You know, like having one friend is the best. That's listen, you don't have that much energy to give to 15 people.

SPEAKER_01 25:54

I feel like that we just had a fellow introvert moment just then. Absolutely. Talk to me about planned boredom. Because in this modern life, we really don't have dead time. That just happens. Unless there's a hurricane and the electricity goes out, then you're really hit with it hard. And you're like, wow, I didn't realize I can't even open my garage door. But that's a different topic. But how do you suggest that parents build in boredom in order to just have that real estate for communication that you're talking about?

SPEAKER_00 26:27

I mean, carving out time. So when COVID happened, and I don't know if this is considered boredom, but and I think the hurricane, one hurricane. Sally probably. Yeah. And we couldn't turn on the TV. And so, like, we have a whole closet of games that we never play, you know, unless we're intentional about it. So, I mean, planning a like a family night, my husband's therapist suggested, because we are such a busy, busy family, she suggested that we write on the calendar like family day. Because if you don't write it down, then when somebody asks you, hey, are you free this day, you're gonna look at your calendar and say, Oh, we're free. And so if you're never intentional about saying, like, I'm gonna plan this thing, you know, I think that like you just never do it. So I think also normalizing it for yourself as well. Because again, we we talk about modeling behavior. So if you're a person that can't sit down or, you know, don't doesn't do well with boredom, that might be something that you can also um work on as a parent, too.

SPEAKER_01 27:37

Yeah, I love that. I feel like you've given parents so much permission to try new things today, pivot when something isn't working. This has just been such a, I feel like a really productive conversation. Do you have any final tips about how to help kids be excited about back to school? Some kids are naturally, just they want to see the friends. Yeah. But for those that have a little less enthusiasm, does anything work?

SPEAKER_00 28:06

So I have this thing that I do in therapy and I do it with my children too. I talk about like a quarter or coin. And once they've told me all the reasons why they hate school and don't want to be at school, then I say, let's flip the coin. What are some of the perks of being able to go to school? Like, there's gotta be one in here, you know?

SPEAKER_01 28:26

And you use like a physical coin.

SPEAKER_00 28:28

I don't, but you can, you know. And but I do it a lot in therapy as well. And so, because I just think that we can tend to focus on how we're not content with things. And I think it's good to remember, like, it's it's sort of like the gratitude journal. It is such a simple journal, but it is so effective. Like, because if what we focus on is going to shape how we feel and then how we behave. And so again, like using the words and articulating and identifying the feelings and all of those things are are helpful and important. So maybe just using the coin kind of trick will be good to say, okay, hey, but what are some what are some things we can be excited about?

unknown 29:11

I like that.

SPEAKER_01 29:12

You know, I also like the the verbal cue of like, and flip, you know, like it's something I feel like could easily be entrained within the whole family, even yourself, like you could hear your own voice and go and flip and then switch it to the positive. If a parent wants to make therapy for themselves and or their kiddos a part of their new school plan, how do they engage with greenhouse?

SPEAKER_00 29:41

What does that look like? You could go to my website. It's www.ghcpensacola.com. That's the best way to reach out. I would say to not wait until the fall. Um many people do, but it's really easier for you to engage in the summertime because normally you have a little bit more time and you're able to not wait until the evenings. You can do a morning session and get it out of the way. I think a lot of times we wait until the school year starts and then the house is on fire. And that's not the most effective time to get into therapy. Yes, please do it if the house is on fire, right? But if you can say, I don't have to just go to therapy to fix the issue, I can go to prevent the issue as well. I don't think people always look at therapy that way. So go into our website, you can read our bios, our profiles, and choose who you want to see. And yeah, we'd be happy. And if we're not the best fit, we are a firm believer in making sure we refer you out because you know, we're not for everybody and everybody's not for us. So it's good, you have choices. And so making sure you also find a place that you feel comfortable with. And if it's not, if one person isn't working, you can try on a different shoe.

SPEAKER_01 30:58

I love that. Yeah, yeah. You have that agency. Absolutely. And you are renting a room?

SPEAKER_00 31:04

Yes. So I will be renting five spaces in the building I have. And so it's for a therapist. And if you're just looking for a safe, nice, calm space to be in, then you know, I'd love to have you. And you can reach out to me the same way on the website, or you can call our the phone number. But I would say the website would be the best way to do it if you're looking, if you're a therapist looking for a place to rent.

SPEAKER_01 31:32

Or you're looking for a nurse nurse.

SPEAKER_00 31:34

Yeah, a nurse practitioner also. If you do like psychiatric meds, and I think it'll be an easy way for you to get in so for referrals, because we're always looking for someone to refer clients to because therapy is great, but it's also sometimes very necessary to have medication to help support therapy. They work great hand in hand. And so, yeah, I would love to have somebody that is interested in being with a bunch of therapists. I love that. And still off Creighton, correct? We are gonna be moving. Yes, it's gonna be still off Creighton, but it'll be on Plantation Road.

SPEAKER_01 32:05

Okay, perfect.

SPEAKER_00 32:06

So the address will be updated on the website.

SPEAKER_01 32:08

Thank you so much. You have added so much value to everyone today, and it doesn't surprise me, but I'm still very deeply grateful. Thank you.

SPEAKER_00 32:16

Thank you. Thank you for having me.

SPEAKER_01 32:19

Thanks for listening. Be sure to subscribe and share. Voices United in Education is a production of the Scambe County Public School.